Working Capital The Real Estate Podcast

Real Estate Personal Branding with Trevor Oldham|EP47

Mar 31, 2021

In This Episode

Trevor Oldham is the founder of Podcasting You, a podcast booking agency that helps people to grow their influence and income through podcast guesting. Because of his success with Podcasting You, Trevor was able to pay off $91,795.10 in student loans in one year.

In this episode we talked about:

  • How Trevor got into real estate
  • Investing in mobile home parks
  • Use a podcast as a tool in real estate
  • How to create value for clients out of being on podcast
  • The biggest challenge when dealing with podcast
  • KPI tracking and how it is presented to clients.
  • Methods of increasing landing page conversion.
  • The on-boarding process of individuals.
  • Mentorship.
  • Resources, books and podcasts to share with the listeners.


Jesse (0s): Welcome to the working capital real estate podcast. My name is Jesse Fragale. And on this show, we discuss all things real estate with investors and experts in a variety of industries that impact real estate. Whether you’re looking at your first investment or raising your first fund, join me and let’s build that portfolio one square foot at a time.

Jesse (24s): All right, ladies and gentlemen, you’re listening to working capital the real estate podcast. My name is Jesse Fragale and today as is the usual arrangement. We’ve got a special guest. His name is Trevor Oldham. Trevor’s experience comes from pod from starting podcasting. You where they have helped over a hundred real estate investors raise money through syndications and podcast guesting. The key strategy they teach investors is to place themselves and talk about their offerings in front of high net worth individuals. These can be doctors, lawyers, dentists, et cetera, as an appreciation of art podcasts.

He’s been kind enough to be on the show. How’s it going today?

Trevor (60s): I’m doing Austin today. Jesse. Thanks for having me on. And I look forward to our conversation and I hope I can bring some value to your listeners.

Jesse (1m 6s): Absolutely. Well, my pleasure for having you on let’s get right into it. What we typically do with, with people that come on the show, we talk a little bit about their origin story with real estate. How, how, and when you were bitten by the bug and what maybe that first investment looks like.

Trevor (1m 22s): Yeah, most certainly. So always been, always been interested in real estate really started when I was back in college and I knew that I didn’t want to go out there and invest in the stock market forever. I realized that there was certain things that could happen in companies. Let’s say the CEO does something bad, the accounting, or I know there’s one, there’s like a stock, like luck and coffee, which is like the Starbucks of China. Well, they found out that there was accounting fraud. So overnight this share price goes from $50 down to $4. That’s that’s like out of my control, I did nothing to cause it, I thought, you know, I thought that’d be investing at a good company.

So I always had that notion that I wanted to go outside of the stock market. And with that in mind, I wasn’t sure how to do real estate investing and really just sort of started, you know, learning as much as I could. I went out and got my real estate license at 19 because I thought that would help me realize that it doesn’t really do do too much when it comes to real estate investing outside of, you know, knowing certain things about a house that you should know. And for me, it was just starting to invest in real estate trusts and looking at those trusts and realizing that what are the different markets that I want to be in because I don’t want to necessarily own, you know, I don’t want to be like the general partner.

I want to be a limited partner in these deals. Cause I didn’t think that was for me. So when I was looking at that, I was looking at like multifamily. I was looking at mobile home park investing. I was looking at self storage and across like these different asset classes for me, it was just investing in REITs, doing mobile home parks. And the reason I did that and the reason I think it’s a cool concept is because we’re basically, you don’t have to necessarily own the mobile home park itself where you just rent out the land that someone’s on. So like, you know, not that I, I thought he physically, I wanna, you know, and obviously invested with other investors, but the cool thing is where I put my money into it and people are able to, you know, they have to fix up their own property.

They’re not calling me. They have to call their own plumber. I’m just renting out the land. And I thought that concept of mobile home park investing was super cool compared to some of these other asset classes in the real estate space. Not that multifamily or, or self storage is bad, even self storage, you have less, you have less going on, but I always just thought mobile home park was very, very interesting. And that’s really where I started to gravitate towards, as I was doing my more of my research.

Jesse (3m 38s): Right on. So in terms of the real estate investment trusts or the REITs that you’re investing in, it sounds like their portfolio was predominantly that asset class were, were you looking at other asset classes in the, in kind of the, the umbrella of re

Trevor (3m 53s): I have? So I was definitely looking at multifamily as well or commercial real estate investing. So I think looking at things that 50 units, a hundred units, you know, and obviously up, so you can picture like, like myself, like I’m in a big apartment complex right now there’s like 300 units. And obviously the cashflow is going to be good there. When you think about, instead of owning like a duplex, a fourplex where one tenant leaves, now you’re 25% of your income is gone. Where I knew that looking at these larger apartment complexes might be a little bit better and it took me a while to go through everything.

And, and for me it was more, you know, this is pre pandemic, so I never expected the pandemic. And obviously there’s certain things going on. I wanted something that was sort of like what I call recession proof. Yeah. I knew that in mobile home parks, you know, it’s typically for someone, I don’t wanna say lower class, but it’s someone who doesn’t have as much money and they can’t necessarily afford an apartment or afford in a house. So they live in a mobile home park. And I found that typically those jobs are going to stay around for awhile versus like a, a white collar job where you could get laid off. And now all of a sudden you lose your house and you lose your apartment.

Or I found that, I just felt there’s the mobile home park investing was the better investment just for, in case a recession comes where obviously, you know, the pandemic, especially in the early, early parts of it, there are a lot of people lost their jobs and I felt confident in that investment. So that was really the thought process behind that and the reasoning behind that.

Jesse (5m 16s): Yeah, it was touch and go for a while there, but that makes sense. I mean, you’re looking for a risk adjusted returns and just kind of be able to at least the downside risk in terms of recession. So looking at those asset classes that, that you felt would, would be best positioned. So you, your entities rates, you’re doing some investing. If you don’t mind me asking you a, you look like a young guy, how old are you? I’m 24. Okay. So you’re pretty, pretty early in the game right now. So after, I mean, doing this right now, have you moved into the space of, of purchasing or is it still the kind of the, the take is that you still don’t want to be an operator, GP, owner, whatever you want to call it.

So, so like right

Trevor (5m 58s): Now I still want to be a GP or an operator. And the reasoning really behind that was when I was thinking about real estate investing. I also made a stupid decision of coming out of college with a lot of student loans. And I realized that before I went out and necessarily took on more additional debt where obviously real estate can be considered good debt. I just wanted to wipe off my student loans before I started to put the deals together and had all that hassle because I want it to be as low risk as possible. And I knew I graduated with about $89,500 in student loans.

And I knew that that was going to take me a while to pay off. So I really just focused on that for a year. I was able to knock that out of the way, and it gave me the, the comfortableness to know that if I’m going to be investing in real estate, if I’m putting, I’m going to be putting guilds together, I’m going to be having, you know, more debt onto me. It’s going to be okay because I don’t have to worry about this bad debt, which I consider to be the student loan debt. Right.

Jesse (6m 52s): And just out of curiosity, what is it that you, you took in school and, and had it helped you at all in terms of what you’re doing now?

Trevor (6m 59s): So I managed and men, so it was called man’s written information, information systems. And then I had a concentration and e-commerce and digital business. So I thought it would help me with the online business, with the company I now run, but I realized everything I learned was just self-taught. So it was pretty expensive learning lesson, but at the same time, when I was in college, I was on my own, I was reading books. I was growing this company. So from that standpoint, I would probably say that’s worth it, but I can’t say the degree helped me that much and running my own company.

Jesse (7m 28s): Yeah. And it’s a, it’s one of those things. Sometimes it’s it’s years after, you know, you’re actually in school where you realized that the network had, has benefited or does benefit you so interesting. Okay. So you slide over from there and you kind of move into this space of, of kind of basically helping other investors out sounds like from a platform perspective, is that right? And, and maybe you could just give listeners an idea of, of what exactly you do.

Trevor (7m 56s): Sure. Most certainly. So to give you some context, back in 2015, I had started my own podcast and I was interviewing people. I love doing it. And then about a year into it, I realized I wanted to grow my own podcast. And I thought, well, why don’t I go on other people’s podcasts? And I’ll be able to reach a new audience. And this was 2016. I started to do that. And I realized that by going on other people’s podcasts, I was growing the listenership on my own show. So that started to get the, the idea turning of, wow, maybe this could be a service. And then in 2017, I launched a service.

I started working with a turnkey real estate investor out of LA. She started to pick up deals for her service from being a guest on podcasts, started working with other clients. They started raising money, they started getting more exposure. And then this was about six months into it. I was like, wow, this could actually be a full-time business. And that’s really how the idea has grown pretty much over the last three and a half years has been focused on helping real estate investors, basically just going onto podcasts and us, our team doing all the work for them. So they just show up for the interview. And then they can obviously talk about their story, talk about the deals that they’re putting together with trying to get more exposure for those deals so that they can raise more money.

Jesse (9m 5s): And just, just cause, you know, when you’re in this world, you kind of, every time you hear anything to do with advertising, there’s always that in the back of your head of whether you’re in Canada and you’re dealing with OSC or securities laws, or you’re in the States dealing with the sec, you know, how do you traverse that aspect of, you know, going on and just you can’t really just, not everybody can just come out and say, I’m raising money for this thing here. And, and I’m on your podcast. So is that something that you guys think about or are you kind of put it on the, on the individual who’s who’s going on these products?

Trevor (9m 35s): Yep. So we typically, when we, we typically have it on the client just to make sure that they’re all buttoned up, making sure that they have like their securities in order to make sure that they’re going on these podcasts, they’re not sharing an offering where they necessarily couldn’t share being sure that it’s set up, whether it’s for non-accredited investors or accredited investors and just making sure that they have all the language. But typically I would say about 95% of the people that we do work with already have all that set up, they’re aware of it. And then the other 5% are people that are currently structuring a deal, but don’t have like anything in place.

And at that point we let them know like, you know, make sure you have all the legal work foundation because we don’t want you to go on a podcast. You talk about it. So you’re going to get the investor at 12% return. And then they, they hear you on the podcast, invest with you, they get an 8% return and you’re like, wait a second. You promise, you know, a 4% difference and then you’re getting sued. So we like to make sure that everything is buttoned up on their end before we’re going out there and placing them on these shows.

Jesse (10m 28s): Yeah, for sure. And you know, I guess it really depends also on the exemptions that they have and what they’re offering. So maybe what you could do is walk us through, you know, I’m a complete newbie to the idea you’re, you’re engaging me for the first time I call you and say, I want to, you know, I’m raising capital for, let’s just say it’s for investments throughout the year. I have one under contract.

Trevor (10m 52s): Sure. So basically what we do with you is we’re first off, who’s your target audience who you’re looking to speak to, obviously, you know, we went over a couple of different niches in real estate. You have, you know, mobile home park, you have self storage, commercial real estate, you have wholesalers house flippers, you know, there’s all these different areas and there’s going to be shows for all these different areas. So for us, and would it make sense to put a, a wholesaler on a show that’s talking about mobile home park investing. I just, it just wouldn’t make sense. So first and foremost, we try to find out who is your target audience?

Who do you want to talk to? And once we find that out, we would start putting together a list of shows based on that target audience. And then we also like to target accredited accredited investors is more often than not, you know, maybe if you’re a house flipper and a wholesaler, it wouldn’t make that much sense, but if you’re raising money, it makes sense to go after accredited investors. So we’ll put together a list of show, star, game doctors, lawyers, dentists, anyone that’s going to probably have a high income and can meet that accredited investor threshold. And basically we’ll put those together for a client, make sure that everything looks good.

And then basically we’ll go out there, do our job, place you on these shows. And then we really like not, that’s sort of like the step out where we stop and we like to make sure that you’re prepared for the show and make sure that you’re going on these shows and just providing value, sharing what you know, and at the end of the day, if you do a good enough job, providing value, people are going to want to invest with you. And we find that people, when they go on podcasts, it almost gives them a little bit more credibility than someone who hasn’t. And we find that a lot of the times it is someone, even if they have one deal and they talk about the first deal and they want to put together a second deal, someone can hear how they put that first deal together, realized that they do know what they’re talking about and then want to invest with them on that second deal.

And, and to help them get them started. And we see that as well.

Jesse (12m 37s): Right on. So we had, we had Michael block on the show for a second time, a few, Oh, wow. I think probably over a month now time flies, but we were talking about building platforms and it sounds like this is definitely a piece of it. I’m curious, the, you know, knowing a little bit about this, you know, there’s one thing to be on the podcast. And we talked about this on that show where you go on the podcast. That’s great. But then if you don’t have that lead magnet or you don’t have that place to send them to kind of generate that, you know, the whole concept of this is actually retained.

So w you know, walk us through that. What do you kind of set up for people to make sure that when they’re on a podcast, it’s not all for not it’s that they go on and they get the value out of being on there and being exposed to that audience.

Trevor (13m 22s): Yeah. And I’m glad that you mentioned that because I think a lot of people have the expectation of going on a show and then being able to just send people to their homepage on their website, where that’s probably not going to be the best place to send them where you want to have that lead magnet set up. So for our company, we use lead pages. So depending on the type of show that I’m on, I’m sending, I’m sending the, the audience to a specific landing page. And on that landing page, it may be a discovery call to learn more about your company. It may be a free webinar, may be a free ebook. You know, typically I recommend not doing the free books.

I find too many people have it, but doing like a free web webinar or masterclass, you know, something a little bit along those lines where you can literally just be reading the webinar, going through the book, but just recording yourself on video instead. And we find that to be more valuable because once people listen to, I start to get in your email funnel, and then you have your email automation set up because a lot of times someone might hear your story and think that, yeah, this guy sounds cool. This woman sounds cool. I want to learn more about them, but I’m not ready to invest with them while they take your masterclass.

They’re on your email list. You have them in an email, automated sequence. You email them, you know, I don’t know, five days in a row going through who you are, what your company does. And then they’re on your mailing list from there on out. And then two months down the road they’ve been hearing from you once a week, they like your offering. They, they trust you. Now. Now they’re ready to invest with you. Where if you send someone to your website, they’ll go check it out. And then maybe I don’t, I don’t know what to do here. You know, just, just their website. All right, I’m going to, I’m going to leave where you don’t that lead. We’re sending them to a direct landing page where they only have one thing to do again, which is scheduled call, but yeah.

Watch your masterclass, watch your webinar. It’s making it a lot simplified. So that person only has one action to take. And then you get them into your marketing funnel.

Jesse (15m 6s): Yeah, it’s interesting. The only recently it took me a while, but for myself, I have a very, very high level proforma, like an Excel proforma. So when you’re taking a look at a property and if anybody wants it, you can go to the working capital And it’s just, like you said, it’s just a landing page. So it’s, you know, provide an email and download, download the Excel file. And you know, if it’s a value, fantastic. If it’s, if it’s not, you know, Eva, you’ve only given an email. So it sounds like something like that, something simple where you can get somebody over there and at least get them into the funnel.

Trevor (15m 41s): Exactly. And that’s going to be the biggest thing is just getting someone to go into that funnel and just to have them to start off there so that you can continue to market them. Like a lot of the times in real estate, it’s a sales and marketing game. The more people that, you know, the more that you market yourself, the more money that are going to be able to raise. And the way that you do that is by getting more people in your marketing funnel. The more that they’re going to get to know you, because obviously if you have access to, let’s say unlimited capital or near unlimited capital, that’s going to give you peace of mind. If you’re going out there and trying to raise money for deals, knowing that if you find a great deal, you’re going to have the partners behind you to invest with you because you have built this network of people.

Versus if you’re going out there trying to put deals together and you found a great deal, but you don’t know who to turn to. You’re, you know, this is a good chance you could lose that deal just cause you don’t have the right network. You don’t have the right connections there

Jesse (16m 29s): Right on. And for, for your team, you know, w where is it that your work ends and, and, you know, the, the investor’s work begins or, or they, they, they give it to another company. And what I mean by that is, you know, you get them set up, you got them on the podcasts, you get them in the email funnel. Do you also do the kind of crafting of the touch points in terms of the emails, or is that something that you pass them on to somebody?

Trevor (16m 55s): So I actually passed them onto someone else. So there’s actually a real, another real estate investor like myself. And she runs a company where she takes people’s podcasts, takes real estate investor interviews. She takes them, puts them on social media for them. She’ll also create their content funnels for them. She’ll help them if they wanted to launch their own show. So she takes care of all of that. It’s, it’s two totally separate businesses. But when I found out that she did that, it was like the best strategic partnership, or I’ll send her clients and she’ll send me clients. And then it just, it works out perfectly.

So we mainly just focused on getting people booked on shows. And then she takes care of like, if they need our marketing automation set up marketing funnels, set up, she’ll take care of all that work for them where that’s not sort of our expertise where she is an expert in that

Jesse (17m 40s): Right on. So what do you find is the biggest challenge that you have when you have individuals going out to, to come on these podcasts in terms of able to get on certain ones and you know, which, you know, you do you find, you know, between the, the, in the universe of podcasts, you know, the ones that are good, maybe not as good, that has larger audiences, smaller audiences, how do you navigate that? Yeah.

Trevor (18m 4s): So typically we’ll look at the real estate investor and see what they’ve been able to accomplish, and that’ll help us gauge what type of shows that we want to start pitching them to. If it’s someone that hasn’t put more than a few deals together, it’s going to be hard to pitch them to say bigger pockets, where typically with someone going on there, they’re going to have a lot of deals under their belt. But that’s not saying there are tons of medium and even small sized podcasts out there that have listeners that would be love to listen to your story. So it’s really figuring out how many deals have they put together? What sort of can they talk about?

And then an issue I see sometimes when we have with clients, cause we work with them to put together what we call, like their pitch that we send out to podcast hosts. And a lot of the times they’ll, we’ll send it over to them and they’ll tweak it. And there’ll be like too overly promotional. Like as an example, we might have someone like why every real estate investor should invest in Baltimore. You know, it’s, it’s, you know, that’s a little too overly promotional where we can say the benefits of investing in Baltimore or something along those lines. So I find that you may be very successful as a real estate investor, but the podcast host also wants to know the value that you’re going to be bringing to their audience.

So you don’t want to make it all about yourself. And that’s a common issue. I see where you can talk about what you’ve done in Baltimore versus saying why it’s a great investment opportunity. And that’s just something I think comes with time, especially if you’re going out there and pitching yourself to these shows. It’s like, what is the value that you can provide the podcast host and not make it so much about yourself? Yeah,

Jesse (19m 31s): For sure. And I think it would behoove me not to ask. So we run a podcast it’s about 50%. I would say roughly half of the audience is American, roughly half is Canadian. And then we have, you know, a little bit from here and there across the pond and in, in the UK and Australia, for those that are trying to look at say markets like Canada, for instance, whether you’re in Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal. I just find that oftentimes they’re a little bit shortchanged in some ways, because all we care about most of the time is, is American securities laws, American debt.

So, and it’s a bigger market. Like just, let’s be honest when you have somebody that would come to you from one of these markets that isn’t the U S or maybe even a smaller area in the U S is there a different approach you take? Is it that, you know, you try to get them exposure, excuse me, exposure in some of the major American markets, but, but also make sure that you’re focusing on local markets in their particular geography.

Trevor (20m 29s): Yep. That’s basically what we’ll do. We’ll have a conversation with them and ask them, especially if they’re from candidly, do you just want to go on only us shows? Do you want to go on shows based out of Canada? Do you want to go on a mixture of both? And we just get their gauge? You know, typically there’s going to be more real estate investing shows in America, just given that there’s a bigger population, but there are enough shows out there specifically geared towards Canadians in the real estate investing space. So we really just try to get a gauge. Typically they want to go to the us because they want to build a bit of a bigger network and they find a little bit more value.

And that’s typically what we see, but there are capabilities out there being able to target Canadian real estate investors as well. If that’s the only country that you’re investing in. And let’s say that you’re raising money in Canada, then you know, obviously you don’t want to make too much sense going on these us shows because I’m assuming that the laws are going to be different.

Jesse (21m 21s): Yeah, for sure. And in terms of how you track, you know, like the KPIs when you’re trying to figure out, is this working, is this not working? Oh, we had a great show here. Let’s, let’s do more of those. How do you, how do you go about that and how is that presented to your clients?

Trevor (21m 35s): Yep. So typically we’ll look and want to set up a landing page for them again, sort of like the lead magnet, it’ll be a specific lead magnet to the shows that they go on and we’d basically have the client send the audience to that show. So we’ll be able to, they’ll typically get an email from the host saying your email went live today and then tomorrow we’ll go to the landing page and check it out. And if we see, let’s say 20 new clicks that we knew that it was directly correlated to the interview and that’s how we’re able to check it. And, you know, it’s honestly up and down sometimes you’ll think you’re on a big show and you’ll get five clicks from it.

And sometimes you’ll be on a small show and you’ll get 50 clicks from it. So it’s nice to track to see what your message resonates with what audience. So it’s typically you want to have that landing page shut up so that again, you can track it where if you’re just sending people to your homepage, it might be a little bit difficult if you have, especially multiple ads going or sending people to your site from different ways. Where again, if you have a specific landing page just for podcast interviews, it’s going to make it a lot easier.

Jesse (22m 35s): Yeah, for sure. And it sounds like, so if somebody doesn’t already has a website, would you, would you add the landing page just as maybe another link in the, in the website, sorry, excuse me. And the website with maybe a different URL or is that how you’d go about it?

Trevor (22m 49s): So that’s one way, and we’ve done that in the past, but I, right now, for me, I use late lead pages and I find it to be easier to design where basically I’m connecting my domain to it. And like, it looks like it’s going through my website, but you go to it. And I found the templates are a lot more customizable. It looks a little bit better. You only have one thing in mind, which is to, for my purposes, it’s just to schedule a call with myself and whatever it may be for you. And I found that by using lead pages, it made it a lot easier where there’s no menu bar at the top.

People can’t click around, they just have one thing. And one thing only where I found that if I put people on my website, they would go to the landing page and then I could see that there are gone from the landing page to the about page and then to this different, then the blog page. And then they would leave the website and they would never get to the, to the goal that I want them to do. And I found that I was able to increase conversions quite a bit by having them just go to the specific landing page where they couldn’t click around on my side right

Jesse (23m 46s): On. And his lead pages. Is that in the same vein of like convert kit, it’s just kind of a, it’s a, a landing page for customizable landing page.

Trevor (23m 54s): Yep. Yep. Correct. And similar if you’ve ever heard of click funnels as well, it’s similar to that, but I believe, I think I pay 79 a month for it and it works perfect. I know ClickFunnels, I think is about, I think it’s 200 a month, so it’s definitely cheaper than that. And it, by, I love it. I’ve been using it for quite a while now. And it’s perfect for setting up landing pages

Jesse (24m 13s): Right on. So in terms of the individuals that would want to move forward with something like this, I know a lot of things today are bespoke in terms of pricing, but w ballpark, what, you know, what does a service like this cost, the, you know, the investor that wants to be engaging with, you know, they have a goal of, I want to be on, you know, a podcast a month for 2021.

Trevor (24m 36s): So we typically have two options where we charge you the three K or 5k for our services. And with that, we usually look for an investor that has about three years of experience or more because we’ve spoken with investors that have only been investing for one year. And typically it’s a big investment for them. Where if it’s someone that’s been investing for three years or more, they have typically more than one deal under their belt. They see the value in it. They’ve, you know, sometimes they’ve been on podcast, sometimes they haven’t been on, but typically if you’ve been into an investor three more years, you’re going to have the capital.

And that’s really what we look for. And we look for people that are making six figures or more in their business. And typically if someone’s in their first year real estate, that’s not, you know, not to say that it can’t happen, but it usually doesn’t happen. So we look for someone that has a little bit more

Jesse (25m 25s): So for the, you know, the individuals that are looking to go into say, it’s, let’s say it’s a $3,000, you know, offering what, you know, what’s involved in that, you know, we talked about what, what you do, but if you could break it down for individuals that as in weather, what are they getting? How does the onboarding happen?

Trevor (25m 43s): Sure. So they’re going to have a dedicated booking agent from our team working 24 seven to get them booked on shows. We create their pitch for them, recreate their one sheet for them. And then we also put together a list of shows to pitch, make sure everything looks good on that end. And then our team will basically handle all the legwork. So on the three K package, we’re booking them on 10 podcast interviews. So our team will basically handle all that legwork for them. We’re sometimes we even schedule the interview for the client, if that’s where they like more often than not, we just pass them back along the booking link.

And then we’ll, we’ll prepare them for the interview. We’ll follow up with the host, find out when the interview is going to go live and really just do everything for the client outside of that, showing up for the interview. And that’s really like what we like to do for them. And, and some of is where we have people that say, you know, Oh, your, your price is too high. And then I also respond to that as like, what’s the value of your time? Like anyone can go out there and get themselves booked on podcasts. It’s not, it’s not the hardest thing in the world, but is it the thing that you want to be spending your time on? If you’re, if you’re a real estate investor, I don’t think you want to be sitting down writing your pitches, crafting everything to go out.

I think you’d rather be spending your time networking with podcasts, raising money, making more connections. And I find that as well. Okay, cool.

Jesse (26m 56s): So you, you, you know, you go through this process, you have people coming on, the different shows for your team. You know, once you do pass them off, say to the, you said that strategic partnership you have with, with this other business, and then they would be the ones that would actually create what, you know, the campaigns in terms of promotion, marketing, potentially even doing their, their social media for these interviews. Now, how does it differ for when you have an individual that say, you know, just similar to, like you said, as a few years experience in real estate, but instead has a podcast, is the approach different with somebody like that?

Is there, is there different value adds or is there a different, excuse me, value proposition.

Trevor (27m 38s): Yeah. So definitely the most, the value proposition that we get is we say we’ll, we’ll, we’ll pitch them as podcasts swaps. And basically what that means is the host will go on their show and you’ll go on their show. And we find that where a lot of times they don’t want to go out there and necessarily spend the time booking guests for their show where we don’t charge for that. We just, basically, you go on their show, they’ll go on your show. And we both, we help facilitate the interview. So instead of say getting 10 interviews, you, you kind of get like 20 out of it where you’re being able to interview someone on your show.

And we find that’s a good value add where we don’t charge a fee for that. It’s just included in the package cost. And it helps to sell because we do work with a lot of real estate investors that are podcast hosts themselves. And they liked that value added service where they, you know, cause a lot of the times the host will say, Oh, can I go on that? Can I go on their podcast? And it’s like, well, you don’t want to, I can’t be like, no, you can’t go on there, but they’re going to go on yours. So it’s true. It’s nice. So we try to clear the air and make it as simple as possible. And it just, I find that it works for both parties.

Jesse (28m 39s): Yeah. It makes sense. I mean, you’re, you’re going to have somebody on, they don’t really have to do much and if they want to be on, they can come on. If, if they don’t, nobody’s forcing putting a gun to their head on it. Okay, cool. In terms of the, the actual process, like how long have you been doing this for, with, with different individuals, different investors?

Trevor (28m 60s): So we’ve been, we launched in December, 2017, so I think we’re going on to our fourth year now. So it’s been, been quite awhile

Jesse (29m 8s): Right on. And have you personally, or, you know, your team, have you use this in terms of your own real estate investing or has it been something that has just been something that you’ve done on the side?

Trevor (29m 20s): So it’s just been something that I’ve done on the side. When I typically go on interviews like this, I typically just talk about our service. Cause I want to get more versed in the real estate world. I want to start to put together my own deals before I go out on my own shows ever before I go on more shows than then talk about my own deals and trying to raise money on my own, just cause I’m at like, not just at that stage yet in my life. So I typically would go on shows to talk about the company and what we do and the benefit investors would get by placing themselves on shows. Right?

Jesse (29m 49s): Well, listen, you’re young. So you got plenty of time to, to work that angle. Well, you know what, if, unless there’s anything you want to touch on today, we can get into, we ask our guests for questions, same questions, every guest. And, and then when you can tell people kind of where to go to, to engage and learn more, if that sounds good with you. Yeah, that sounds awesome. All right. Since we didn’t talk too much about the real estate investing career, we can talk a little bit more generally on business and it would be, what’s something that, you know now you wish you knew when you were starting this

Trevor (30m 19s): Company. I wish I had charged higher prices. That’s been the best thing in my business. And to give you an example, my first started, there was a pay as you go service. So an investor would come to me. I would get them booked on an interview. When the interview happened, they’d pay me $50. Oh, that sounds good. In theory, easy to get clients, but some interviews are going to be booked two months out in advance. So I’m paying my team for the moment. I’m not getting paid till later the quality of clients coming in. Wasn’t that great because there was a low barrier of entry. Then once I started paying three charging clients, three to five K upfront, and before we did anything for them got better quality of clients, better cashflow.

And it’s just, it was better all around. So I could go back in time. I would have been charging higher prices from the beginning. Yeah.

Jesse (31m 3s): Yeah. It’s it’s, you know, to a certain extent, it is like, if it, if it costs, you know, you care about it. And sometimes it is a boat spending a little bit more, but then knowing that you’re going to have follow through from the client point of view. All right, let’s get onto a couple of these in terms of mentorship, where do you see yourself in that world? Do you have mentors? Are you pro mentor?

Trevor (31m 27s): Yeah, definitely pro mentor. So one, I have two coaches. One, I pay them, I pay the coach on a per hour basis every week. And then I also have a coach who I work with, who in a different area where I get him booked on podcasts for free. And he coaches me. They’re two totally different styles. One sort of one sort of like to me is like having like another dad where I can go to him with like different types of questions. And this other one is more about personal branding and building up a brand where this one is more like sales, how to raise, you know, how to put together or how to raise money for the business and, and that sort of thing.

So definitely working with those two coaches is perfect and trying to figure out, you know, the best angle for both of them is definitely been the best thing for my business. And just working with them. I can’t tell you how many times they’ve helped me, especially just pushing me outside of my comfort zone. Yeah. Typically if I come across something and I don’t necessarily want to do it well, if I have to, my coach tells me to do it and I have to meet with them every single week. I can’t just not do it and then come to him and be like, Oh, I didn’t feel like it’s, it’s not going to work that way.

Jesse (32m 27s): Yeah. There’s just a little bit more, more pressure and accountability. And it’s amazing how many people like people that come on these podcasts and I’m sure you’re, you’ve seen it just in the world that you’re in it’s 99 times out of a hundred. They are pro mentor. And they’ll tell you why. And they’ll tell you the steps they’ve taken. I feel like that is very different than the general population, which is unfortunate because I find there’s a lot of value add there regardless of what industry you’re in. All right. Any resources, books, podcasts that you really feeling right now, you’d like to share with the listeners.

Trevor (32m 60s): Yeah. I think one, I recently read and I have it next to me. It’s called Howard raised myself from failure to success in selling. And the, basically the book was written. I want to say the early 19 hundreds by this guy named Frank Bettger and he actually spoke with Dale Carnegie. So if you haven’t heard of Dale Carnegie, he writes a book called I believe how to win friends and influence people. And basically Frank is the, is basically similar to that book where he teaches you all the sales process. And I found, and I find that sales is just such a big thing in business, trying to learn.

And you can think about it. If you’re an investor trying to raise money, money, you have to sell yourself, you have to sell what you’re doing to other investors to potential investors. I find that sales is probably the biggest thing I’ve had to learn in my business. I found that that book was just straightforward to the point, offered great insight, even if it was written almost a hundred years ago,

Jesse (33m 51s): Man. Well, I think richest man in Babylon that must’ve been a while ago too. So there’s a couple of good ones. All right. Last question. Kind of a fun one first car make and model.

Trevor (34m 1s): I would say probably a Camaro. I’ve always, yeah, I’ve always just saw them. You know, you can think of, I always thought of that or Maserati, but for whatever reason, a Camaro has always just stuck in my mind for the longest time. I’ll see them out there driving on the road and I’ll be like, I know it’s not a Lamborghini or a Porsche, but for whatever reason, I just want one

Jesse (34m 21s): An American boy. I like it. All right. In terms of where people can reach you aside from a Google search, is there anything, any specifically you would have them go?

Trevor (34m 30s): Sure. So they can either go to my website, podcasting estate investors, or they can feel free to check out LinkedIn or Instagram just under my name, Trevor Oldham.

Jesse (34m 41s): My guest today has been Trevor Oldhan, Trevor. Thanks for being a part of working

Trevor (34m 45s): Capital. Thank you Jesse. I appreciate it.

Jesse (34m 49s): Hey everybody. This is Jesse Fragale. Before we started this episode, I just want to say thank you so much for everybody that keeps on listening, it really is amazing to me and I can’t. Thank you enough. What would really help us out is if you enjoy the show to go over to iTunes and leave us a five-star review. Also, if you have a favorite episode, what would be great is if you could share it on social media, whether that’s Facebook, Instagram, or LinkedIn, anyways, enjoy the show. Favor. Listening to the work in capital podcast.

My goal is to help individuals break into real estate investing as well as educate experienced investors. If you enjoyed the show, please share with a friend subscribe and give us a rating on iTunes. It really helps us. If you have any questions, want to learn more or likely to cover a specific topic on the show. Please reach out to me via My name is Jesse Fragale, and I’ll see you back here for the next episode or the working capital real estate podcast.