they have gone through, which connects them unconsciously. had an abusive father. Indeed, people with antisocial personality disorder are more inclined to break the law than those with narcissistic personality disorder, psychologist Stanton Samenow wrote on Psychology Today. How did we get here? But Love was somehow surprised that Sherry and Cary heard her very loud murder admission?! Fans realised Love was Joe's murdering match when she discovers his neighbour Delilah (Carmela Zumbado) being held hostage in his infamous book vault. This is a Premium document. "What we can learn from psychopaths like Joe," Neo says, "is that we need to have a lot better boundaries. Joe is a pervert who doesnt have self control even a bit. The goal of intimacy-seeking stalkers is to enter into a relationship with the person they're stalking, who they believe is meant to be with them. Cookies collect information about your preferences and your devices and are used to make the site work as you expect it to, to understand how you interact with the site, and to show advertisements that are targeted to your interests. He is a conflicting character, but I really enjoyed him as a character. Many symptoms of ASPD, like difficulty sustaining long-term relationships, having a lack of guilt, not learning from ones mistakes, and repeatedly breaking the law, seem to be clear red flags that Joe suffers from ASPD. So far, two seasons have been released, and the highly anticipated third season is coming out this October. org.lopes.idm.oclc.org/10.1371/journal.pone. "If he was my patient in season 1, sure, he could be diagnosed with antisocial personality disorder, but upon further excavation, his behavior reveals itself as a trauma symptom versus antisocial personality disorder.". As a result, Lev says that the depiction of Joe throughout You, from the voice-overs that detail his thought-process to the fixation on his latest love object, are "very accurate. Even though he is outright creepy, you cant really spot whats going on in his mind. Introduction. If someone threatens what he considers true love, he's willing to trap and kill them, leaving numerous characters in the series vulnerable, from Benji, the on-again, off-again boyfriend of his first victim Beck, to Ryan, the ex-husband of his most recent victim Marienne. Some people who have been diagnosed with antisocial personality While individuals who seem excessively self-absorbed or have an inflated sense of self-importance are often referred to as narcissists, those with narcissistic traits don't necessarily qualify for the diagnosis of narcissistic personality disorder. Lynzee Smith Jung had similar views like Freud did. He was also portrayed by Gianni Ciardiello, Aidan Wallace and Jack Fisher as a youth. Personality (10th ed.). Yet, the series doesn't acknowledge this reality. The Complexity of The Psychopathic Mind., Leiden, Luke. THE PSYCHOANALYSIS OF JOE GOLDBERG | Netflix Series You - YouTube Despite continuously stalking, occasionally kidnapping and holding people captive, and several times even murdering others, Joe genuinely thinks he is a good guy. Although his morals are clearly flawed, Joe Goldberg sticks to them relentlessly. Love and connection are primary factors that we often seek, and they are Joes primary motivation as well. Freud stated, "adult defenses, are related to early childhood experiences" (Burger, 2019), making sense why he acts how he is A few additional symptoms that psychopathy has when compared to ASPD include a lack of guilt, excessive vanity, charisma, and a lack of empathy. For example, in season 1 of "You," Goldberg hit a man named Benji, his love interest Beck's boyfriend, over the head with a mallet, locked him in a glass box, and killed Benji a few days later. She thrives on being innovative and adaptable, as well as looking for new ways to improve her company. Even Penn Badgley himself had choice words for Joe's biggest fans. Goldberg's penchant for harming or killing those close to his love interest and obsession Beck also suggest he's morbidly codependent, according to Rutledge. They are charismatic and plan everything in advance to ensure that no one notices. There are three types of killers: organized killers, medical killers, and disorganized killers. "We can see that he's more of a covert narcissist than an overt because covert narcissists seem really shy and sweet. He is a bookstore clerk, and that is where he gained most of his knowledge. This ad is displayed using third party content and we do not control its accessibility features. We're immune to trickery, we have good taste in partners, and our BS radars are strong, right? She makes others feel guilty for themselves by doing so in subtle ways. Even though society thinks this Pastoral Psychology, 50 (1), 3952. He fears that he wont be able to protect his son, Henry, from what he himself was subjected to as a child, and he struggles to form a connection with him. If Goldberg was not as good-looking, hilarious, sweet, or smart as he is portrayed in the show, with a different financial status, his character would not be well liked by fans, or even the side characters who trust him. He has often been described as a psychopath, but opinions have differed on what exactly ails our hero. https://doi- And what's more, with the ubiquity of dating apps today, anyone can manufacture a great first impression. In fact, both Hatters Friedman and Lev point out that even though Joe may seem like he truly loves Beck, Love, or the other women he obsesses over, the show subtly demonstrates that, like a real-life malignant narcissist, he doesn't see these characters as human beings with strengths and weaknesses of their own. Guinevere Beck was a central character in television series, You, serving as the titular love interest in season 1 as well as a posthumous character in season 2. Think about it: After Natalies death was basically all wrapped up, Love decided to capture Gil. In essence, they Joe Goldberg is one of those rare sociopaths who come across as very charming. According to the British NHS, someone with ASPD is characterized by being manipulative, deceitful, and reckless. growing up, with a dysfunctional family. The Complexity of The Psychopathic Mind. The Complexity of the Psychopathic Mind | Danielle Rousseau, 1 Jan. 1967, sites.bu.edu/daniellerousseau/2018/12/18/the-complexity-of-the-psychopathic-mind/. Not so fast. "He's positioned as alone in the world, abused and neglected by his mom.". Joe even admits to experimenting with polyamory because he believes it will give him an excuse to go home. He is attractive according to societys standards of beauty, his monologues in the show consist of great humor which makes him a likeable and relatable character, and the way he treats children shows us that hes rather polite, caring, and respectful (obviously not enough to respect peoples privacy). In either case, youve realized that hes a Scorpio. Stay up to date with what you want to know. Naturally, one would be charmed by Joe Goldberg. Psychoanalysis of "You"'s Joe Goldberg - MW Ontario "You don't have to kill someone to get that diagnosis," Scott said. In fact, Ramani Durvasula, a professor of psychology at California State University, Los Angeles and a licensed clinical psychologist, previously told Insider that extreme charisma is a common red flag that someone could be a narcissist. I run the publications Peachy Keen Reviews & Bibliotherapy - Celebrating the Healing Power of Art - and The Horror Maven - A Celebration of the Macabre. 2023 Cinemaholic Inc. All rights reserved. Proudly created with Wix.com. because he doesnt know how to form healthy relationships. Plans out his murders, Just do has a cover story, & it is able to fully backtrack & cover everything up #YouNetflix #YOUSEASON3 pic.twitter.com/lXScPy2jHK. Even though he is outright creepy, you can't really. Rejected stalkers want both revenge for the rejection and reconciliation with the person who rejected them, with their inclination toward both impulses changing on a regular basis. And just as Joe had a tragic childhood, which he leverages for sympathy, people in real life can do the same: "A compelling story about how sad their childhood was evokes this caretaker instinct." However, our hero also channels traits that are not covered by this diagnosis. Berlanti, G., & Gamble, S. (Directors). narcissists partners frequently confuse fear with love and are willing to do anything to keep the peace. Narcissists use their victims as a way to create an illusion in order to fulfill their own fantasies. Growing up, Joe became parentless when his mother abandoned him, and he grew up in a group home where he was profoundly mistreated by the other boys in the house. On top of that, he normalizes all his toxic characteristics, underlining that he does so in the name of love. He is also very manipulative and has a lack of empathy. Is Joe a Psychopath or a Sociopath? Joe devalues his ex-girlfriends in order to manipulate the narrative. Antisocial personality disorder, or psychopathy, is a mental disorder that Joe Goldberg quite evidently struggles with. Trust your intuition, watch for the red flags, and, for God's sake, buy some curtains. Joe Goldberg is a Caucasian male in his 30s, who recently moved from New York to will not harm them, but he is thinking about something different. Goldberg "seems to be an amalgam of personality traits at abnormal levels that are constructed to make a good story and create a character that elicits a certain amount of empathy" in viewers, despite the fact he murders people, Rutledge told Insider. When one problem had finally been dealt with (thanks to Joe, mind you), Love just had to make a new issue to give her life some purpose. Although he seems like a nice guy there is something off about him; he has various personality traits where it seems like he is more than one person. The Role of Trauma in Netflix Series 'You' Season 3 Joe is adopted and cared for by a man named Mr. Mooney, but Joe is not treated well; he is locked in a glass cabinet filled with books, At the same time, Scott said it's important to note that not all people with antisocial personality disorder or an attachment disorder will act violently. This is really well done, Justin. In contrast to Joe, a Cancer would be someone who would bring out the best in you. Fredrick, C. (2020, August 17). ", However, You's characterization of Joe Goldberg isn't flawless. Apart from my professional experience, I am a survivor of Schizoaffective Disorder, Quiet Borderline Personality Disorder, Fibromyalgia, multiple eating disorders, Generalized Anxiety Disorder, and Complex PTSD. "A diagnosis is almost never clean-cut and disorders overlap. I use my personal experiences with my mental health and health to inform my work. You've done a fantastic job of describing each of the defense mechanisms. Joe Goldberg - other other University Grand Canyon University Course Personality Psychology (PSY-255) Academic year2020/2021 Helpful? Oops! Verywell Mind uses only high-quality sources, including peer-reviewed studies, to support the facts within our articles. Of course, Joe is fictional and You is entertainment, so the TV show's portrayal of the character, and the hope that's built into the story could be seen as taking the romance narrative trope of the man seeking redemption through love to the extreme, Furthermore, Hatters Friedman notes that You and some fans' attraction to Joe could be seen as the continuation of a trend thats long been part of popular culture. He is a great example of how someone can be diagnosed using psychoanalysis. I offer a variety of courses and free mental health articles, as well as one on one sessions. While we've known Joe Goldberg to be the obsessive stalker with murderous tendencies for three seasons of You, Love Quinn proved that she was the true psycho of the series in Season 3. Abandoned as a child, Child When you visit the site, Dotdash Meredith and its partners may store or retrieve information on your browser, mostly in the form of cookies. Moreover, Joe's tragic backstory, which includes a mother who abandoned him after he shot and killed her abusive boyfriend and a foster father who locked him in a glass book cage for extended periods of time, establishes the roots of an attachment disorder that make it challenging for Joe to bond with or trust others. Malignant narcissists exhibit the traits associated with narcissistic personality disorder, including grandiosity, entitlement and lack of empathy, but also have antisocial tendencies, including a lack of remorse and blaming others for their actions. Another season 2 scene, when Goldberg says he won't kill Forty even though he hates him because he means so much to Love, further suggests Goldberg has empathy, to an extent. This is because he is so clear about his intentions that even when he is committing a serious crime, he is clean in his own mind. Joe will do whatever in his means to help them out in Rosenbaum KB, Hatters Friedman S. You (the novel and the television series). He is also paranoid and has a lot of anger. Joe's abusive childhood experiences and flashbacks played a crucial role whenever he hurt or crossed swords with someone he loved. As soon as he discovered that he was the murderer, he killed Beck and Candace, covered his tracks, and moved on. The reason is the way he carries himself in front of people. It appears you entered an invalid email. Netflixs You follows Joe Goldberg as he leaves a trail of dead bodies on his search for the perfect partner. The balance of power and respect are important distinctions between normal and abuse cycles. Instead, the best hope for anyone in a relationship with a malignant narcissist in real life is to get out. He thinks about himself as a passionate lover and wants to take away all the problems from his girlfriends life even if it means killing her best friend. One that truly loved beck and other that just wanted to get his way no matter what. It can be inferred that because Joe was abandoned by his mother, but continued to hold her in high regard, he developed an unhealthy outlook on love and developed toxic codependency. Joe Goldberg, in his role as You, possesses many of these characteristics as a murderer. Love, however, didnt give a single shit about that. Date: September 22, 2020, Comparison of Theorists: Joe Goldberg Trauma isnt the primary cause of Joes antisocial and narcissistic tendencies, but it does play a big part in the development of such disorders and behaviors. J Am Acad Psychiatry Law. What is the status of Joe and his relationship with you? He falls in love with those women who he thinks need his help. All rights reserved. Tell us you love Punkee without telling us you love Punkee. and how Joe has become the person. Love Quinn, an unhealthy type of ENFJ personality type, does not belong in this category. Natalie wasnt a threat to her family because Joe decided to not pursue the relationship, yet Love still murdered her. style is a defense mechanism intended to ward off feelings of anxiety". Of course, he does seem to have a fair amount of charisma, which means he also imbibes psychopathic traits. A psychoanalytic of Joe Goldberg (You) - Psychology 12 There is no definitive answer to this question as it is difficult to diagnose someone based on their behavior without knowing their thoughts and motivations. He is a master in the skill of manipulating people using his innocent face. self-defense to save himself and his mother from his father. It is equally damaging to a persons psychological, spiritual, or social well-being if he or she is emotionally or spiritually abused. Joe is a bookstore manager When season 1 of "You" aired, fans took to Twitter to discuss Goldberg's mental health, though he's never diagnosed with a particular condition in either season. is a horrific thing that people have, we always must remember that people have problems like. Burger, J. M. (2019). Hatters Friedman and Lev particularly cited Joe's behavior toward his newborn son in the third season of the series as unrealistic. Joe Goldberg is most likely a killer of the disorganized variety, as opposed to an organized killer. individuals' personal memories and ideas," which why Joe would defend the person he loved to They become more manipulative and they're more likely to commit crimes." Without spoiling anything, there are multiple close calls within the show where viewers may find themselves hoping Joe gets away with his actions. In previous seasons, it was easy to see Joe as a psychopath due to his severe obsessions and violence with women, but there is more to Joes mental state than meets the eye. When Love no longer provides Joe with the supply he requires, he ends her life. (2020). each theorist has a reasonable point in the development of personalities (Burger, 2019). What???? He was a sociopath,had co- dependency issues and as slightly hinted by dr. Nick he can have 2 personalities. It is time that we take trauma into account when addressing these disorders and see them for what they are: coping mechanisms. Anushka Sens Am I Next To Release Digitally This Womens Day, Actress Says Im Fortunate To Be A Part Of Such An Important Film, Farzi: Prime Video Curates A One-Of-A-Kind Show-Themed Perfume That Smells Of Freshly Minted Notes. INFJ is a combination of the three functions (introverted feeling, moderately developed sense-making, and judging abilities). Privacy You is a show that focuses on Joe Goldberg. Joe Goldberg Personality Type, Zodiac Sign & Enneagram ", According to Lev, "Stalking is seen in the full spectrum of narcissism." "The higher you are on the narcissistic spectrum, the less capable you are of changing," says Lev. "adult child" (Whitfield, 1991, pg. Looking into the perspective that Freud's structure of Id, Ego, and Superego, we can Moreover, when he stalks Beck's wealthy friend Peach, who believes he's not good enough for Beck in season 1, or the comedian Henderson, who may have predatory intentions toward underage Ellie in season 2, he becomes the resentful stalker who sees himself as defending the downtrodden against these entitled, underserving individuals. How Accurate is The Depiction of Stalking in Netflix's You? - Verywell Mind The popular Netflix series, You, recently released its third season. Joe Goldberg Joe Goldberg is a young man who seems to be in his early to mid-20s. The release reignited Twitter speculations about Goldberg's mental health that have been swirling since season 1. Scott did say, though, that the closest clinical diagnosis to a "psychopath" or "sociopath" is antisocial personality disorder, and that Goldberg does indeed show some hallmark traits of the disorder. Top editors give you the stories you want delivered right to your inbox each weekday. And the only reason she was able to do these thingswithout being disturbed by the public was because Love had the funds to open the bakery alone. Demographics According to Mental Health America, symptoms of codependency include a need to control others and an unhealthy dependence on relationships. Goldberg shows signs of antisocial personality disorder. Henry already had survived, the measles when anti-vaxxer Gil admitted that it came from his children, but Love still bonked him on the head which led to his death. On the outside, a cooling-down period may appear to be a peaceful process, but on the inside, the victim is constantly trying to figure out how to get over the narcissist. Do you want to share your story? Love Quinn 'You' Character Analysis: Why She's a - StyleCaster You can find even more stories on our Home page. Retrieved from netflix/watch/80212201?trackId=13752289. The murders of Joe and Love differ in several ways, as do the types of serial killers. However, his charming demeanor keeps him under the radar even as his body count rises, and Joe Goldberg keeps falling in love again and again. Throughout each season, he would stalk the women, and become so involved with their lives that he often ends up getting caught in a situation which compels him to commit unethical and illegal acts in the name of love.